If I Ran The Zoo, AO3 metatags edition

[erinptah]

In light of all the discussion about how AO3 handles fandom metatags (more background in this post)…here’s an idea I’ve been thinking about for a while, seemed like a good time to write it up.

This is not any kind of official proposal! I don’t have the coding knowledge to submit a functional version the Github repository, or the authority to make such a submission get accepted. This is just “if I was the Grand High Dictator of AO3, here’s a thing I would have someone do.”

(Usual disclaimer: I’m a tag wrangler. I’m not any kind of supervisor. All feelings and opinions are my own, not speaking on behalf of any other wranglers, or AO3 volunteers in general.)

The Problem: Metatags are confusing for AO3 users. There doesn’t seem to be any clear evidence on how confusing, or for how many users…but this is officially considered A Problem, and if you’ve ever written in to Support to ask for a fandom metatag, you’ve probably been told about it.

(Still running this unofficial metatag survey to resolve some of my own curiosities. Would love a nice round number of responses.)

AO3’s Current Approach To Solving It: Get rid of as many fandom metatags as possible. This allows us to confuse AO3 users in whole new ways!

The Approach This Feature Is Based On: Give AO3 users more information about their fandom metatags.

The idea is for this to be built into the site code. I don’t want the info limited to users who write in a Support request, or ask random tag wranglers for help on Reddit, or dig through the site FAQ and hope the relevant sections are up-to-date! I want it displayed automatically. I want Users Who Didn’t Know They Needed It to see it anyway.

 

It starts with adding a new status option to tags. I’m calling it “Generic Metatag” status.

This does not replace or override any existing info about the tag. (And it definitely doesn’t make any changes to “which fics appear in what search results.”)

It’s just an additional yes/no option. From the perspective of tag wranglers, it’s one extra ticky box on the tag-editing page.

I made a little mockup of how this could look, using a famous “Related Fandoms” metatag. The tag that brings together all the fanworks for a franchise that started with a public-domain book fandom, and now consists of many decades of different adaptations, re-imaginings, spinoffs, and sequels. You know it, you love it…

…that’s right, it’s Dracula & Related Fandoms:

(New option at the bottom of the image.)

“Would you make this box tickable for every tag?”

Nope.

Quick background for non-wrangler readers: The options on a tag-editing page are different for different kinds of tags. Example: only canonical tags can have subtags — so the “Add subtags” field doesn’t appear on the editing page until the tag becomes a canonical.

I’m thinking, this ticky box only shows up when a tag (a) is canonical, and (b) has more than 1 subtag.

“Once the option is available on a tag, who decides whether to tick it?”

The wrangler(s) of that fandom.

Full stop. No further approvals process needed.

“Okay, so after this box gets ticked, what does it do?”

More background: For any given metatag, wranglers can see a page for All The Subtags, and sort the list by how often each tag has been used.

For Dracula &RF, it looks like this:

So my vision is, we use this data to generate a new little info box — a public one, this is for every AO3 user — on every Generic Metatag’s works page.

For the Dracula fandom tree, it would look something like this:

Exact details open to workshopping! But the main points are:

A line about what kind of tag this is, and what you might want to do with it. Modeled on how the info page for this tag (and every other canonical tag) says “It’s a canonical tag. You can use it to filter works and to filter bookmarks.” Plain language, short and sweet.

A list of (clickable links to) the most popular subtags. Because I was copying text in by hand to make this mockup, I only wrote out the top 3 Dracula subtags (Hellsing, Dracula the novel, and Hotel Transylvania). But maybe the real version would pull the top 5? Or the top 10?

For generic metatags with LOTS of subtags: a link to the full list. For Dracula &RF, there are currently 45 different fandoms subtagged to the metatag. We don’t need all 45 spelled out here, just a “See all subtags” link after the first few. (It could send you to the tag info page, which includes all the subtags already.)

And that’s my dream New AO3 Metatag Feature!

There is, obviously, no single silver-bullet update AO3 could add that would make the tag system Not Confusing For Anyone Ever. But we could push small changes to make it moderately more user-friendly, and here’s my pitch for one of them.

Questions, comments, thoughts, feelings? Want to point out aspects of this I hadn’t thought of, or ask about details I didn’t type up? If I became AO3 Dictator tomorrow and made this real, would it make your fandom browsing better, or worse? Comment away.

Comments

[axolotls]

I like this a lot!

I think 3 with a link to more works if it's over, say, 4-5. Wouldn't show more than that to not clutter the page.

[erinptah]

Thank you!

I picture a longer list having columns, which would make it a little less obtrusive. Say, 3 fandoms in the first column, then up to 2 more + the "See more" link in a column next to it.

[axolotls]

That could work for desktop, likely not on mobile though, where screen space is the most scarce already, hmm.

[erinptah]

Make it a pre-collapsed box you can tap to expand? Or add a "Subtags" button next to the "Filters" button, that also reveals a by-default-hidden panel of options.

[axolotls]

That could work for mobile/small screens!

[stardust_rifle]

The survey seems to be showing me a list of responses. Did you intend that?

I think your idea is definitely interesting. I’d probably make a work skin to hide it, but I feel it has some utility for people who are genuinely confused.

[erinptah]

Fixed the link, thanks! (The responses are supposed to be public, but the link was supposed to go to the original survey.)

Heh, I have my AO3 site skin set up to hide a different info box already, so I sympathize. This one does have clickable links, with the idea that, even if the user knows other ways to reach the filtering results for a specific sub-fandom, this offers a faster and more-convenient way.

[quaelegit]

This is an interesting idea! It's focusing on a different problem than I have so far in my discussions (I've mostly been trying to figure out what problems *users who say they don't like AMT tags actually have*, and compromises that might work for both me and them. I think I've already talked about these on discord, but maybe I should write up my own post on what I've been thinking though!)

Personally, this wouldn't make much difference to me, because I already know & love the tag info page, but it does seem like most users don't even know to look for it, so a popup could help! I haven't even turned off the "looks like this is your first time logging into the archive" popup so I don't really care about the extra header space on my screen lol.

OH WAIT including #of works in the subtags would actually be new -- those numbers aren't displayed on the "tag info page" that I linked, and having them all in one place could be helpful. Right now if I want to compare tag sizes I have to go look at each tag and record numbers in a spreadsheet.

[erinptah]

It does actually tie back to that -- one complaint I've heard about AMTs (not often, but not never) is "why isn't this broken up into smaller tags for the individual fandoms?" Or, if the user is a step more self-aware, "I don't understand how to find the smaller tag for just the fandom I want."

Spotlight that info a little more, make those users happier!

If your thoughts have gotten long enough, writing a post where you can have them all together and share the link around fandom-at-large definitely sounds like a worthwhile goal.